Episode Transcript
[00:00:03] Speaker A: Hello everyone, and welcome to the first MoCA SMC podcast. We are two black single mothers who made the decision to have and raise our children on our own. My name is Hera and this is my friend Aisha and fellow SMC.
[00:00:18] Speaker B: Hi.
[00:00:20] Speaker A: Aisha and I decided to start this podcast together after meeting as admins on a social media space called Moca SMC. The MoCA SMC site is an unapologetically black space for black women to discuss the trials, tribulations, and joys of this non traditional path to motherhood. There are several SMC social media forums, some focused on trying to have a child, others focused on parenting those children. But after spending time in those spaces, I think we both realized that there was need for a space for us to discuss these issues through the intersectional lens of being black smcs. So while this podcast is not directly affiliated with the social media page, other than the fact that both of us continue to admin that space, we decided to create this podcast for much of the same reasons that brought us together. We believe the SSMC community and the world need to hear fresh perspective, and we want to be a resource for women like us who are pursuing this nontraditional path. So in this very first episode, we thought it would be appropriate to introduce ourselves, explain what single mother by choice actually means, and what we believe is unique about the experience of a black SMC within the larger SMC community. So before we get into the definition or what we believe the definition is, which is surprisingly concessed among many circles, let's tell the audience a bit about who we are. So I will start us off. My name is Hera. I have two daughters, ages seven and two.
They both share the same anonymous donor. I was about 33 years old when I had my oldest, which is still relatively young for an SMC, and 38 when I had my youngest. Yes, this makes me 40, and I had to celebrate my 40th in quarantine, which I'm still very bitter about, by the way. But I digress.
So I decided to become an SMC after my son, who was 15 months old, was murdered by his biological father. After that, I knew I never wanted to be in family court again because I never wanted our broken system to determine whether or not I could protect my children. I live in Washington DC and I am a manager at Microsoft. In addition to being a mom, I'm an author and a civil rights advocate, mainly focused on women's and children's rights. I also enjoy fitness and I'm known to stress bake, Aisha, tell the world about yourself.
[00:02:44] Speaker B: Hello, world. No developer spaces, right? I know. Tech spaces. Okay, so my name is Aisha, and I am an SMC to two little girls, six and one and a half. And my little girls have different donors, and so I'll get to that more later in the season. So I began the thinking process when I was in my early thirties and a few years post divorce, and I recall the actual day where I decided CPath was going to be the path for me. So it was right around the time that Halle Berry was pregnant with her first child. And I remember crying to my stepmom, who was, who was in her fifties, 60 year age range. And so I remember crying to her, saying that I really wanted to be a mom. You know, I was divorced and I was dating, and it wasn't going well. And I was like, I want to be a mom. And so she eventually was like, well, why don't you just do what Halle Berry did? You want yourself a baby, go get yourself a baby. You know, go get a sperm donor. And I was just like, huh? Come again? And that was when the seed was planted.
And so I did and went and found, you know, a cryobank. I found a reproductive endocrinologist. I was on. Baby center is where I started to do my research, and the women there really helped me to get on the path. I will say that it took me from my early thirties into my mid thirties before I started, but that was where the seed was planted. And so I actually started actively trying when I was 37 and I conceived my first child on my second IUI, it was one, two, three, easy peasy. The pregnancy was uneventful. It was a great experience. I worked out up until 36 weeks, no complications.
And then I delivered my daughter when I was 38. And I say all of that to contrast with my second pregnancy, which was a journey that I could never have anticipated. It was a rough road to get pregnant. The pregnancy was just a total shit show.
It was anything but easy. But both of my girls are here, they're healthy.
And so I delivered my youngest at 43.
And so my journey to my second daughter was a real turning point for me. It was humbling.
When I say my first pregnancy was easy, I'm pretty sure after that pregnancy, I said some pretty cringe worthy things. I was on the top of the world. I was like, this is easy. I knew I wanted to have a second, and I was just not really ready for that experience. But I can tell you that experience was so humbling and life changing and it ultimately prepared me for being an admin in a space where we have to. We're discussing and trying to do things that a lot of black women just have not been exposed to. And so, throughout my three year journey to my second daughter, I'd accumulated a wealth of knowledge and resources. And so I find myself healing from that traumatic conception experience through helping and supporting other women. And so, yeah, the journey to my second daughter really stretched the bounds of what I, you know, my love, my faith, because you'll find that I had some pretty low and dark moments, but I love my girls, and they're here, and I wouldn't change it for the world.
[00:06:37] Speaker A: Awesome. So I will be completely transparent. I love my kids to death, but I hated every second of being pregnant both times. And, like, with the second one, I was just like. I was like. It was almost like. I, like, forgot how bad it was after the first one. I know they say there's, like, some kind of hormone that, like, actually makes me forget because, like, yeah, people would, like, never have babies, but I was just so miserable. Like, I don't know, I just. I'm so glad they're here and, you know, I love them so much, but I was so miserable.
[00:07:12] Speaker B: I know.
[00:07:14] Speaker A: So let's drop some knowledge on our listeners.
So we're going to try to, like, put some data into every episode here, because both of us, like, you know, being in tech probably, you know, kinds of skews us towards, like, being a little bit of data nerd, which is nothing wrong with data nerd, right? I'm, like, all about it. So I went to the Internet and I was like, you know what? I'm going to search on, like, some single parent stats, right? Just to kind of ground the conversation and, you know, go from there. So.
So let's see here. So, according to the US census, the majority of the 11 million single parent families in the US are headed by single mothers. This stat, however, doesn't show how many of us chose to start a family on our own. I'll also mention that black women disproportionately make up single parent statistics.
And the numbers of single black mothers appear to be dramatically increasing. According to Statista, in 2019, there were 4.15 million black families in the US with a single mother, which is an increase from the 1990s levels of about 3.4 million. So more than a third of black children in the US under the age of 18 live with unmarried mothers, compared to 6.5% of white children. So I'm sure that both of us have heard the tired and frankly racist trope of a single black welfare mama. When I went searching for data on black smcs, there was a surprising gap in data.
Not surprising to those of us who are like, in this, but still nonetheless surprising.
Most information you'll find on SMC centers on whiteness. And perhaps at least, this is my theory. This is because being in XMC is expensive and usually means the mother is at least financially stable. I say usually because there are lots of different types of single mothers by choice, but our racist society, I don't think, can make the leap to recognize that there is diversity within this group of women. So, Aisha, what do you think? How do these stats land with you?
[00:09:19] Speaker B: So, I mean, that's what they are, right. But there's a need to kind of disaggregate and break it down by race. Right. And so I think that anything, you know, you mentioned race and it becomes taboo and people want to shy away from it. But I will say, given the stats of single mother headed families in the black community, actually provided a bit of a shield for me considering this path. It wasn't a hard leap for me to see that it's something that can be done, because I've got, you know, almost all of my sisters, either through marriage or through circumstance, are single moms.
And so, yeah, I've seen it. You know, I've seen it growing up did have its challenges, which I hope to get in front of some of the more common challenges. So it wasn't too far fetched for me. Now, I will say what I started doing because I think traditionally, in some. In american spaces, we are a very private, socially conservative race of people, and lots of people spend time in the church and things of that nature. And so we're more private. And so what I've started doing in recent years is that when surveys come out about smcs, I try to make sure that I participate in those surveys to start to try to change that narrative and starting to blacken the space just a little bit with my input.
And so, yeah, so those stats don't surprise me at all.
[00:11:05] Speaker A: Yeah, I guess, like, I wasn't surprised by how many single parents are black. You know, I definitely understand that there are various reasons for that. I think I was, like, more than surprised than anything. I was just disappointed that when it came to the topic of SMC, it was just such a white space. And, you know, I know that, like, both of us have probably experienced this on the. On the social media sites as well.
You know, it's and there are definitely aspects of our experience as black single mothers. Not that it's a monolith at all. You know, there's definitely lots of diversity within the black community and even within, like, our community of black smcs. But a lot of times, you know, there's issues that we deal with that are very, very unique and not majority white issues.
And so it was just interesting to kind of look at all of those national spaces and just all you see is, like, a bunch of white women talking about, like, white women problems.
So, yeah, so that kind of leads me to the next point here. Like, what is an SMC? What is the definition of an SMC? And so I again went to the Internet and was like, all right, how does Google define this? Right? And so it's interesting how hotly this topic is debated. Actually, you would think it would be, like, fairly straightforward, but it's not. But according to the single mothersbychoice.org comma smC is someone who decides to become a mother knowing that they will be the sole parent for their child, at least at the onset. But this is interpreted in many different ways. For example, with someone who has a one night stand and realizes the guy is not interested in being a parent and goes through the pregnancy anyway. Still be considered an SMC? Or does the title get to get reserved only for people who intentionally get pregnant or adopt to become single parents? So my definition, I guess, is somewhat traditional in the aspect of I do think that you should.
A true SMC is somebody who plans from conception or from the moment that they pursue adoption to parent alone. There's nobody else that's going to be paying child support for this baby or could pay child support for this baby. And, like, your intention was to do this at all points in this whole process. Right? So for me, somebody who goes to a bar and gets pregnant and then decides to still go through it with the pregnancy, that would not be an SMC. That would be a single mom, but that would be a single mom by chance and not necessarily by choice. What do you think, Ayesha?
[00:14:01] Speaker B: So, yes, so I think an SMC, a single mother by choice, is a woman who decides either to conceive or adopt on her own, that they are the sole caregiver, sole provider, emotionally, financially for that child. No one else can put legal claims on that child that that child is yours, kind of free and clear.
And so I will say that when I decided to dive into being a single mother by choice, I was on part of the national organization. So that frames a lot of my perspective in my formative years of being an SMC and how I view it, there are certainly different ways to become a single mother. But I do believe that there are some challenges that are very unique when you intentionally decide in your head that I'm going to do this and we're going to talk about that throughout the season. But planning is kind of like that foundational rock, you know, in your mind that you are intending to try to either conceive or adopt, and so that's going to guide your path.
You didn't just decide one day like, oops, right. This was something that was very thought out and very well planned.
[00:15:36] Speaker A: So I completely agree. I think one of the real big distinctions, and I say this, having been a single mom by chance as well, is that some of the drama that comes with being a single mom by chance, like custody or child support or, like, all the things with co parenting don't exist for us now. I am definitely one to not be part of the oppression olympics, right? I hate when people are like, oh, my friend is married, and I hate when she complains about how hard it is to be a parent. Like, look, parenting is hard. It's hard for married people. It's hard for single moms by chance. It's hard for single moms by choice. Like, it's different flavors, but it's all hard, you know? Like, there's things that we deal with, like, you know, not being able to take a shower or not being able to pee alone. Like, those are things that, like, are hard. Right.
And, and it's just like, I think it's just, it's, it's like, unique challenges. It's not necessarily harder or easier. It's just different. And I think that's why, like, you know, it's not like we don't, we don't protect our spaces to be, like, exclusionary. I definitely think there's people on our for, you know, who, who, you know, run in the same social media circles who are single moms by chance. And there's things that, like, we share. I mean, I guess you could, like, put a Venn diagram with, you know, like, commonalities. But I do think that.
I think what's hard is that the reason maybe potentially also people get upset when those issues converge is that, you know, many of us have chosen this path intentionally to not have that kind of drama. Right? And so, like, we certainly have our fair share of drama, but, like, it's not the same. And I think, you know, it's, it's hard because you can't necessarily give someone advice on, like, how to deal with their baby baby daddy drama. Like, if you don't have a baby daddy, you know?
[00:17:41] Speaker B: Yes.
So to add to that, you know, I think that there's something to be said for not expecting someone else to pull weight. Right. And so I think when you go into this knowing that it's your. It's just you. You wake up every day knowing it's all on your shoulders, and, you know, and that can be a bit of a heavy lift. But, you know, I'll drink my coffee, I will take my ginkgo, and I will take my vitamins, and I'm here for this. Right. But I think, you know, I would really struggle with a teammate who was not pulling their weight. And, you know, there's that added overhead of resentment. And so I would go through my. I would imagine having to go through my day, and I say imagine. But as I said, I was divorced. I'm divorced. And so I actually know what it's like to go through the day carrying the burden of, hey, dude, are you not going to do your half of the household chores? I could not imagine parenting with that same type of framework emotionally. And so I am so glad for this path. It is exhausting and it is challenging, but every day I wake up, I have the joy and the freedom of saying, I know what I'm going to do today, and I know it's just going to be me, and. And I'm okay with that.
[00:19:07] Speaker A: Yeah, I think, like, I mean, there's definitely all the things that you mentioned, you know, are things that, like, make me really love the fact that this was an option for me. But I will say that if I can. If I can pinpoint, like, one thing that is super hard for me, at least, is that, like, those moments, right. Like, all of those, like, amazing moments of childhood, like, part of the reason that I love being a parent.
Nobody cares about those little moments as much as I do. Right.
[00:19:38] Speaker B: And, like, we care. No, I get it.
[00:19:43] Speaker A: And my parents care. Right? Like, they're super caring grandparents, but, like, you know, just, like, things like, oh, my gosh, you know, she just said mama, or, like, she's walking, you know, and there's super. You know, my family is just super supportive, and they're all very excited, but there's not. It's not the same level of excitement that a parent gets when they say, wait, wait.
[00:20:06] Speaker B: So I know what I do with my eldest is I share those moments with her, and I'll be like, did you just see. Did you just see what she did? And so we just there and we giggle together. But I do get, you know, another adult having skin in the game, right? Especially, like, during this pandemic where it's like, mama needs to tap out. Like, you know, I will say the thing that I find most challenging right now for me is, you know, even on a day off on, during the week, I still have to get up and do daycare, you know, the whole morning routine and drop them off, you know? And in my single days, I would be like, yeah, you know, I'm taking off work today. I'm taking a vacation day, and I'm going to sleep in late. Right. I don't think that I will see another sleep in late day, you know, for a very long.
[00:21:02] Speaker A: Age, which is funny. Like, I think it'll actually be, you know, it's. It's fun because, you know, I feel like some of the, some of the, you know, there's phases of parenthood. Like, right now we're in the toddler terrorist phase at my house with my youngest. And it's like, you know, all kids have different personalities, but there's, like, some, like, you know, kind of shared crazy about toddlers. I think they're all just little people trying to kill themselves, and we just have to, like, try to stop it from happening.
[00:21:31] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:21:32] Speaker A: I really enjoy the fact that our kids are the same age and for the same. Look, I'm with you.
All right, so before we close out, I do have another important question here. Like, what makes the black experience different? Like, what are some of. And this is kind of like, you know, maybe a little bit projection for our listeners of, like, what's to come during this season and the next season? But, like, what for our listeners who are just like, okay, well, what is unique about being black with the SMC experience? Like, what are you going to teach us? Right. And so, I mean, some of the things I'm thinking about is, like, for example, I think choosing a donor is potentially harder for us. There aren't as many black donors. And then, you know, there's a lot of considerations when choosing a donor outside of your race. So that's one of the topics.
And I also, you know, there's definitely a lot of health things that come into play that I. That I'm looking forward to addressing in this season. Just, you know, about, like, health advocacy and things like that. What are your thoughts, Ayesha?
[00:22:48] Speaker B: So I think what you said earlier about walking that line between what we know to be a single mother by choice compared to what society looks at as single moms. Right. And so one of the, I sit on two sides of the fence on this one. I do value the things that make an SMC different. The intentionality. Right.
The single minded purpose, the, you know, the grinding, because, you know, financially, you want to set your kids up. Right. So. And the planning to become a mom. But then I also, in the larger spaces, the predominantly white spaces, there is a lot of, we're this kind of a single mother and not that kind of a single mother. And so I, I push up against that every chance that I get because, because behind it is the stigma. Right. They don't want to, they don't want to walk that line of being just grouped together with other single moms. When the world looks at us, the world is not going to say, I know how you conceived, I know how you adopted. You know, as a single mother, they're not going to look at that. The world is going to group us all together and say, we're single moms. And, you know, just from, from a personal, professional perspective, I think that if we reach out to the margins of us and we pull that in, then we create resources and we create community, you know, for us inclusively. Right. But then we each know what are, what differentiates our path. But to a lot of the white SMC spaces, they are intentionally trying to distance themselves from other single moms. And when we say other single moms, we mean single moms of color, particularly black single moms who are out there on that far region that they may not normally interact with in their own lives. And so then they're like, we're not like that kind of single mom because I did it this way. I wanted my kid. And it's just like, there are single moms out there by chance. So I will, I will, I will cape for those single moms by chance. I will keep for a black single mom in a minute, you know, and still acknowledge that there are differences in that. You know, I woke up one day and said, I'm going to put pen to paper and I'm to, you know, plan. Here's what I need to do. Here's what I need financially, because I know every day it's only me, but what I'm not going to do is engage in the conversation, you know, separating them out, because the world is going to look at me as that type of single mom before it looks at me as a white SNC.
[00:25:29] Speaker A: I think there's also something to be said, for the fact that, I mean, if you just look at statistically with, like, how much black women are making for every dollar that a white man makes, right. Or even a white woman makes or even a black man makes, right, we are the sole financial providers for our children. So one of the other things that I really hope that we can do this season, given that we're both very successful professional women, is really try to extend some of the knowledge and some of the learnings that we've had throughout our career, you know, some of the financial planning that we did before we had children and all the considerations that we had to take into place so that we can arm these women with knowledge and give, you know, so that they can set themselves up for success and also, you know, really, really have a great foundation to build their family. Because I know we're both passionate about, like, being very financially stable, especially in this position.
We will talk about the pandemic because it is real. We are living it. And I think, you know, again, it is hard for everyone out there. I am sure, like, I can't even imagine. I honestly cannot even imagine what it would be like as, like, a single person with no kids right now. I feel like I'd be going insane. So for all of the insanity that I deal with in my household, I thank God that my kids continue to keep me laughing. And, you know, I don't have to drink alone.
If your children are in the house, it counts.
[00:27:09] Speaker B: Well, I will say this in setting the tone for the season, a lot of I think we'll be curious to find out about the life of Moca SMC. And one of the burning questions that I want to get ahead of right before we jump into the rest of the season is, do you hate men?
[00:27:31] Speaker A: Oh, my God.
[00:27:31] Speaker B: And I will tell you that I love men. I do not hate them.
I imagine dating, you know, some of them soon, in the future. But what I will say is that I didn't want. I wanted to decouple my becoming a mom. And what I felt was a true life passion from being in a romantic relationship. And so while I do love men, I dated them extensively and thoroughly. You know.
[00:28:04] Speaker A: I'm no longer dating to find the father of my child. Right. I don't. I have a sperm donor. He's great. I don't know personally, but, like, I'm very thankful for him.
[00:28:18] Speaker B: That's what I needed.
[00:28:19] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. I don't need a baby daddy. I do want a partner. Right? I want to. I want to meet.
I want to meet an amazing man, and I want to build a life, that person, and have him be, you know, I want to have a great relationship, and I miss that and look forward to that after the pandemic is over. But, yeah, I mean, I do think that, you know, that, you know, obviously we'll have to talk about dating is a whole nother thing, but I think that the. The interesting thing about this choice, it's similar to, like, a financially stable woman. You know, there's going to be some men out there that are just not able to handle it. Right? And there's men out there who are not able to handle the fact that we've made this decision. But the thing that really helps me sleep at night is knowing that those men will weed themselves out. Because when we tell them that we are independent financially and that we have our own children and don't need them to be a daddy to our children, you know, they'll self select, and that's great. So they can pave the way for the ones that we actually want to be with.
That's a whole other episode for a whole other time.
Aisha, it's been a pleasure. I look so forward to working with you on this.
Our listeners, every week, one of us will produce a show, and we'll discuss a variety of topics related to being an SMC.
And we hope you'll continue listening as we collectively work together to unpack what it means to be a black SMC. I feel like this is going to continue to be an iterative conversation that pops up, like every time we aim to help other black women who might be considering this as an option, as well as validate the experiences of the many women out there who are living this journey alongside of us. And if you're not a black SMC, if you're not a black woman, we also invite you to listen because you might actually learn something. And hopefully our comments will help enlighten and potentially diversify the space. So until next time, we are the Moca smcsitive.
